VCCA Home Forums GENERAL DISCUSSION New User Forum VIN and title

Hello. I just got what I thought was a 51 3100, 5 window. At least, that's what the title says. However, the serial number on the cab is completely different and I doubt that it's actually legitimate either. It indicates that the cab is a 53 model 3100. How can I legally get a title to this when the one on the cab appears to be fake and the one on the title doesn't match? I've attached a photo of the cab serial number plate. The entire thing is painted over so I don't know if it's the actual plate or if it's been replaced. Is there a way to safely remove the paint without damaging the original plate (if it is original)? I already feel like an idiot for not knowing ahead of time but there it is... any suggestions?

Every state has its own regulations and processes for dealing with this issue. Right or wrong, they are in control of titles and registration.

My first advice is that whatever you do make sure that you do not remove whatever tag is on the cab. While I do not know how you acquired the truck, you should consider contacting the seller. It might be as simple as the fact that you were given the wrong title.

One item to check is the serial number stamped on the engine. In some states the engine number was used to register a vehicle.

I know this step will take some time and effort plus research. All the years 1947 through first series 1955 are called Advanced Design. However, there were many design changes and upgrades over that long run. There are differences between an 1951 and a 1953 truck. Contact some of the VCCA members in your area who own Advanced Design trucks. They can help you determine what you have.

Thank you. I've already contacted the seller. When I purchased the truck, I asked to see the serial/VIN number and he said it didn't have one and that most people just create a plate to match the title. The title is for a '51 3100 and from the exterior of the truck, that's what it looks like. For example, the door handles are the '51 design that turn down to open vs the '53 door handles that have the push button design. However, once we got it home, I found the VIN plate (or serial number plate). It reads that it's a '53 3100 truck and what's left of the interior bears the design elements of a '53 so that at least appears to be accurate. The most I can get from him now is a bill of sale that will match the serial number of the cab. I can't even be mad at him because I believed him and missed it because it was painted over so I took him at his word.

The hallmark of a thief. Illegal in every state. Call the police and file a complaint. There are a LOT of lawyers making a very good living going after people who sell cars that are not what they are presented to be. I'd recommend talking to one.

Can't disagree more. I would be livid.

Your seller was hoping for someone to come along who would trust him and not check these things before handing over the money. You were the right guy for him. Unless you are madly in love with this truck and willing to, possibly, go through HELL to get it resolved with your state, I would demand my money back. This could cost a lot of money and might be impossible to resolve in your state.

Mike

You are getting some good advice. You do need to contact either your DMV or local police.

If the vehicle is stolen the state could impound it until the situation is resolved. Worse case is that you could be accused of the theft when you try to transfer the title and register it in your name.

I absolutely do not intend to do anything illegally. Here in Michigan, I believe that I'm able to get a bonded title on a vehicle that doesn't have a title. We've had it for 11 days. Yes, I was absolutely the "buyer" he was hoping for. Lesson learned. The question really is moving forward. Obviously, the title he gave me is no good to me at all. He is willing to give me a bill of sale for the correct serial number on the truck and as long as that serial number is legitimate, I'm okay with a boned title. He's located in Texas. My son is in law enforcement here in Michigan. I've done a check on the number that's on the truck and there's no liens, accidents, or theft reported on it. If there's anyone here who has more info regarding the laws in Michigan I would genuinely appreciate your insight. Right now, my plan is to try and find out if this plate that's been painted over is actually original. If it is, I'll apply for a bonded title. I believe it takes 3 years for it to convert to a clear title but it will take me at least that much time to get it running and I'm not in a hurry. If it's not, I will probably try to sell it for parts or as a whole but with honesty in the transaction. While I am completely aware that I've been 'conned' and I could go after him, I don't want to spend my emotional energy or my money trying to do so. I am willing to accept that part of this is my fault for being ignorant and call it stupid tax and just move forward.

If your Son is in law enforcement,I would think he would be an excellent resource for finding out your best and next move.
Why don't you "RAT OUT" your Texas seller and possibly save another Chat member the headaches that are ahead of you.

Mike

Sorry about the delay in replying. I am not getting notifications when there is activity on this thread. I came back here to let everyone know how I ended up working this out. Hopefully, it will be helpful to others. Either way, here's what I did. Each state is different so I can only really tell you what I learned and what my options where here in Michigan.
First of all, I was able to confirm that the serial plate that is on the cab of the truck is the authentic plate and not a duplicate so that was good news. I had already made up my mind that if it wasn't, I would sell this (with full disclosure) and simply pass on this project.
With that knowledge in hand, I looked up the laws here with the help of my son and found that without a title, without knowledge of the trucks history, I have three options. First option is to request a title correction. This is applicable when building or replacing parts that hold a different VIN or serial number than what is one the current title. For example, if the cab had been changed out at some point, the serial number would need to be corrected to match the new one. Since I couldn't confirm that it had been changed, I didn't go with this option.
The second and third options are nearly the same. If the truck is valued at over $2500, I could get a bonded title that would convert to a regular title after 3 years. If the truck is more than 10 years old, and it is valued at under $2500, the state of Michigan will issue a title that is self-certified.
In all three cases, a police officer has to certify that they have inspected the vehicle VIN and condition. In the second two options, it's also necessary to get an appraisal on the vehicle from a certified dealership. In this case, a dealership specializing in classic cars. Fortunately for us, we have such a dealership just 8 miles from our house. Also, my son is a police officer and was happy to do the inspection for us.
The dealership very kindly appraised the truck for under $2500 so we didn't need to get a bond. We did everything legally and above board.
Regarding suggestions to "rat out" the seller, I was honest with my son and also the secretary of state. My son basically said that nothing is going to be done about it. That's as far as I know to go. At any rate, I REALLY DO APPRECIATE everyone's input on this. I just wanted to come back and let you all know how it was resolved. Yes, it was a bit of a hassle, yes it cost a bit extra, but it's done and legally mine.
Suggestions (NOT from here) to just buy a fake VIN plate off of eBay seem to be the popular solution. Or even more shocking to me are the suggestions to buy a title from someone online. Both of these solutions are illegal and it's surprising to me how very blatant people are in pursing them.
Thanks again to everyone here. I have a very long way to go with this project but now that this headache is over, I feel like I'm finally able to get excited about it. I've waited 30 years for this. I'll be back with more questions as I go forward.

I'm glad you got it worked out and did it the right way. As for not getting notifications when someone replies to a thread, when you start a thread or click Use Full Editor the option to be notified when there's a reply is checked by default. Unless you uncheck the box you should get an email when someone replies. If that's not happening you should send a note to the webmaster - memberservices@vcca.org.

Thank you for that.